You know, we didn't set out today to kind of go through a list of, of all the different types of marketing that you can do. You know, I've got written down, you know, like radio advertising, joining the local chambers, networking groups, etc., you should be doing all of this stuff as well as the digital stuff. And whether it's social media, PPC, SEO, or whether it's any of all that just should be a large mix.
It should be a large mix. And critically, it shouldn't be a sort of as well as, as if they're all in separate sort of pots. Should it be? They're not lots of isolated buckets, are they? You know, you can go to a networking event and learn a little bit more about how to refine your messaging. And that can feed through to making your website better and your PPC campaigns better. And, you know, you really do have to be learning from all of these different channels and sort of plugging all of that data together and doing something very joined up.
Okay. Welcome back to Digital Marketing From The Coalface.
Um, I don't know what episode we're on now.
Uh, one hundred and two ish, something like that. Yeah, we're past one hundred. The hundredth episode. Anyway, you you, um, decided that you would pick a subject today that you wanted to talk about, which is great. I did. Yeah. So I'm really excited to hear what that is.
Here we go. Yeah. So basically what I thought we could have a little chat about is, um, something that's come up a few times over the last couple of months, which is just this idea of people putting all of their eggs in one basket, I guess, and sort of, um, focusing or hyper focusing on a specific tactic focusing. Yeah, I'm gonna go with.
Is that a thing?
It's yeah.
Okay.
A bit buzzwordy I know, but yeah, on a specific marketing tactic. Um, I think we did. Yeah. Yeah. No, no, we've never made a mistake ever. Yeah.
Everyone can do this. Even people that do it for a living can do it and get it spectacularly wrong. I mean, we're not spectacularly wrong, but.
No, I mean.
We've we've had an overreliance on search engine optimisation, I would say. Is that fair?
Yeah, I think so. And I think what's interesting is we sort of started discussing this internally. And then we had a sort of, um, I guess over a few weeks, a number of clients sort of do the same thing or people sort of come out of the woodwork as having done the same thing. I mean, some of them were enquiries from new businesses and that sort of thing. And they were saying, you know, look, we've been we've been putting all of our focus on our search engine optimisation. And, you know, it has been delivering, but we haven't really seen many leads or, you know, we've, you know, we've been doing that for six months and nothing's come of it sort of thing. Um, and also, um, a very sort of long term client of ours who obviously we won't name any names, but they've been sort of very wedded to the idea of PPC as their sort of driver of growth for for many years. And then obviously, um, I think, well, I think with all tactics, things have a sort of finite shelf life, don't they? And so they're now sort of being squeezed out by competitors. And there's just more competition basically, and that's making it very difficult for them to do what they're going to do. They used to do. And then, you know, you have that sort of crisis moment where you sit down and you think, oh, this thing that we've sort of put all of our energy and all of our effort into isn't actually working. And I think that's probably something a lot of people listening will relate to.
Yeah. I was in, um, you know, I'm in the mastermind group, which is a bunch of agency owners, um, predominantly in the States, although there is one other agency in the UK, part of the mastermind group. And I had a kind of, um, come to Jesus moment with them and, uh, you know, and they kind of made it pretty clear to me that this reliance that we had on SEO was never going to deliver the growth that we were looking for. And, you know, as a result of that, we've broadened our horizons. And what do you know, we've got some really good gigs out of it.
It works. Yeah. But I think, you know, I think part of this is to do with the way that an awful lot of marketing tactics are sort of sold, if you like, to people. You know, I think it's always that, you know, this is the ultimate solution. This is the this is the real deal. This is the tactic that will actually make you money versus all those other tactics that didn't work. And I think a lot of the time that is the problem, isn't it? I mean, certainly with SEO and inbound marketing, people are very guilty of doing that. You know, you'll see people saying like, this is the only way to grow your business or this is the most organic and sustainable way to grow your business. You should put all your eggs in this basket. You should just go for it full throttle and not be terribly sort of realistic about the the variety of options that are out there really.
Yeah. I mean, we did focus in on search engine optimisation, inbound marketing, getting people to find us when they were trying to solve a specific problem. Um, and it worked. It's worked. It continues to work well for us and it's worked well for us, but there was an element for us or an aspect to it. There was something anyway, um, which was, which was like, well, we sell this as a service. Sure. So we kind of need to, to shoot. I mean, do it for ourselves. And which we did. And it worked. And I certainly used to mention that to people if I was speaking to them about inbound. I used to say, well, it's how we generate pretty much all our business. If you take referrals and a bit of networking out of the equation, it's the main way that we generate business ourselves. Um, and I think what I saw happening for us was we, you know, we started doing lots of gigs for other B2B organisations like us and it worked fantastically well. It worked better for them, for them than it, than it did and has for us. Yeah. And we've kind of learned the hard way that in our niche, which is to use your term hyper competitive. Mhm. Um, a reliance on an overreliance on one tactic is dangerous if you're in a niche that's less competitive. Um, there aren't many players in the market that you're in. Perhaps there are barriers to entry then inbound can still work fantastically well.
Yeah, well, yeah, that's exactly it. I mean, I think part of it is to do with and I might be making a bit of a leap here, but part of this is to do with the sort of the way people think and certainly buy things online, isn't it. You know, like you say, if you're in a, a niche where there's sort of three or four key players and somebody is googling a question, they're looking around, they're sort of looking for a service or whatever, and they come across a really useful article by you and a couple of other people. It's not very difficult for them to remember. Oh, you know, that was that really cool article. I read that brand obviously know what they're about. I think when it gets really noisy, like with us and there's sort of like, you know, like thirty agencies in every town, village and hamlet in Scotland. Yeah. It's very difficult for people shopping for an agency to remember which agency it was that published, the cool guide that they read three days ago or whatever. So the whole idea of inbound that methodology, I think is powerful and effective. But I think the problem is when you sort of introduce lots of competitors and lots of noise, you can't really expect customers to sort of remember. And I think the same thing is true of PPC and all these other channels. You're talking about one way of getting in front of somebody once, and that's fine, that's fantastic. But if it's going to take three or four points of contact for somebody to actually engage with you, then you actually have to be sort of in three or four different places. You can't just rely on them finding you in search once and then remembering who you are.
Mhm. So if we take, um, I don't know, for argument's sake, a professional services company. Mhm. Um, I don't know, accounting services or.
Yeah. I think that's a good one.
Marketing services, whatever. Just professional services company. Where do we think it makes sense to direct the marketing budget?
Well.
Okay, I'll ask ask to get things going. Like yeah, search engine optimisation, SEO, inbound marketing, content marketing, putting stuff on your website so that you improve your search rankings get found. Is that worth doing?
Yeah, absolutely. Especially if it is something that like we would consider a sort of considered purchase, where somebody's going to do a lot of research before they engage. They're going to have lots of questions. They want answering, getting there and putting content out there for those sort of longer tail search terms is always going to be useful and effective. Yes.
Okay. All right. So what dovetails nicely with search engine optimisation in this marketing mix.
I think pay per click or paid advertising and SEO always goes hand in hand. Okay. Just because paid advertising lets you sort of insert yourself into, into the sort of peripheral searches that people will make. So you can.
Alex. Alex. I tried PPC pay per click advertising as one, as somebody called it once and it didn't work. It cost me a fortune. I spent thirty eight quid on it and I never got a single lead.
You did it wrong.
But yeah.
Yeah.
People are saying that, you know, people are going to say that, you know, you know, they don't recognise. I don't think that doing SEO, search engine optimisation is labor intensive, which means it's expensive. Yeah. And so if you actually work out the cost of securing organic rankings in certainly in some niches, niches, it's, um, hugely.
Way more than you just.
Way more than just using paid search. So explain how does the, how does PPC dovetail nicely with, as I put it anyway, dovetail nicely. And these are my words. So change them if you want with with search engine optimisation.
Well, the way I see it is that basically. So you do a load of research into how people shop for whatever it is you're selling, and you work out what search terms they're using, and then you need to sit down and work out, you know, which ones can I rank for organically in a reasonable time frame? And the ones that you can't, PPC dovetails because it then allows you to go and pay for the traffic from those search terms that you can't necessarily rank for organically. And that's important because again, going back to this point that people do not search in one way, they do not just enter something once in Google, click a thing and buy your product or service, especially not if it's something like accounting or stuff like that. There'll be three or four things that they'll go and query or ask or whatever, and you want to be across all of them. So yeah, it fills in the gaps for, for SEO, I'd say.
But Alex, Alex, nobody ever clicks those adverts. I never clicked them. And I don't know anybody who does.
The millions of people that click on them every day would beg to differ. Yeah. I mean, that's the thing, isn't it? It's it's really interesting how people do have these opinions, though, because it flies in the face of actual solid evidence. Um, yeah, the data is out there. Most people click on a Google ad when they Google something. It's not a case of sort of most people go to the organic listing, the majority of searches click.
So basically you can short circuit the process of achieving organic rankings using paid search. So if paid search. Sorry if SEO is a big part of your marketing mix marketing strategy, then you should almost certainly be looking at PPC at the same time. Two reasons I guess you can get in front of people for search terms, who've typed in search terms that you will probably never be able to rank for organically because they're hyper competitive, hyper three times.
Three times.
Yeah. Um, but secondly, um, it's quick. Yeah. It's short circuits, the process of months and months of content marketing to try and achieve a ranking, only to find out that that ranking doesn't generate business anyway, for example.
Yeah. It's quick. And you also don't tie yourself into this loop, which and this isn't to sort of, um, be down on SEO. It's a very useful tactic and a huge part of our marketing arsenal. But it gets you out of this thing where you're constantly racing other people to re-optimise and sort of claim rankings, because if you publish a really good piece of content on a for a keyword, it is only going to be so long before somebody comes along and tries to outdo you and nudge you back. Yeah, we've.
Seen it ourselves. You know, we've lost loads of great rankings because we've just realised we're fighting a losing battle. We we ranked well. We got we got beaten. We got, you know, drop down page one onto page two onto page three. And you know, we were coming up against behemoths. What good word.
Yeah, absolutely. It's something, um, Julie's really fond of saying isn't it, that, you know, SEO is a sort of ongoing process. And I think that's the thing. What you have to realise is you are entering into an arms race with everybody else who wants those rankings and sometimes.
Controversial arms race. Well, in the present, in the present economic and global political, geopolitical climate, you use a term like arms race.
Sorry, Ukraine, Russia, China, everybody else is at it. Yeah. Um, but yeah, and I think sometimes people see, I mean, it's still very competitive, but it's a much sort of cleaner, neater, shorter competitive cycle. You're not sort of locked in to, to trying to produce better and better content.
Okay. I'm with you on that. And, uh, the market research data, info, help assistance that you get back from a PPC campaign. And we've talked about PPC a fair bit in the last few podcasts. Um, it is hugely powerful as long as you don't, again, as we talked about in the last podcast, please go and listen to that last podcast. If you're thinking of using PPC because it'll save you a fortune. Yeah. Um, like don't set it and forget it. Don't leave it alone. Monitor it like a hawk or a kite. Like so many kites around here. I just.
I think I saw.
On the golf course. Oh, there's a kite driving home or cycling home. Oh, there's a kite. Not fantastic.
Yeah, it's one of the perks of living here. There's also ospreys round by us on the river.
There's ospreys over at the Boyne Lodge as well.
Amazing. They are amazing.
Birds. And there are hares in the field outside the house. My house.
Oh, I saw a hare. I saw my first hare the other day. I thought of you when I saw it. It bounced.
Your first hare. Whatever.
Um, no. I think I've seen them before. The first one I can remember seeing.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Welcome to Digital Marketing from office, where we talk about kites, hares, and.
Not marketing.
Not marketing.
But there's something else. Before we got wildly off topic there that I really wanted to come in on, which is just this whole idea that like these channels, these tactics, the way people describe them sometimes as almost like separate entities is like fundamentally the problem, I think because like you say, you can run a PPC campaign and glean really useful data that you can then just go and directly incorporate into your SEO campaign. You know, you learn by running ads on certain keywords, which ones actually convert and which ones send the dross traffic that never enquires. I mean, we've seen this ourselves. You know, you'll advertise on something like HubSpot developer and get nothing and advertise on HubSpot designer and get really good enquiries.
Well, HubSpot design agency. Yeah. That's right.
And, you know, just something like that can save you hours of time because now you don't have to go and optimise an organic page for HubSpot developer because, you know, it's not a good keyword. Yeah. So I think, you know, just just being agile and remembering that all the data in each respective sort of pot actually influences everything else is.
I mean, that one example is going to result in probably about twenty grand's worth of work. Yeah. And that was a all right, the click. I think the clicking PPC cost us twenty quid, twenty five quid. And obviously, you know, there's a few twenty five quid clicks have resulted in nothing.
Absolutely nothing.
Overall, the investment in clicks has generated this piece of business, which is fantastic. So, you know, if you don't kind of buy into this idea that PPC can work, if it's done right, it really can work. But search engine optimisation, pay per click, it's it's in the search ecosystem, whether it's organic search results or whether it's the paid search results, they're all on that page. It's one place. It's not really a diversification of your marketing strategy to be using just PPC and SEO. Is it the kind of two peas in the same pod?
Yeah. And I don't think it's anywhere near broad enough for, like I say, the way people search nowadays, which I guess sort of the, the other sort of spoke to this, I guess in my mind at least is things like this podcast, um, YouTube videos.
Nobody listens to this.
Drivel. I don't know what you're talking about. Some poor soul is listening right now and questioning their life choices.
As am I.
Yeah, well, um, comes with the territory, I'm afraid. Um, no, I mean, I think, you know, this is the thing, isn't it? People are not just going to Google to ask questions. They're all the time, you know, they're on social media browsing their LinkedIn feed. They're listening to podcasts on Apple podcasts on their way to work, or they're, you know, on YouTube, I mean, YouTube, I, you know, I'm not the biggest proponent of or supporter of video content generally, but I mean, YouTube is supposed to be the second biggest search engine, isn't it? A huge amount of people spend time on there.
Yeah, I think we mentioned that in episode two of this one hundred and two episode long.
Well, there we go. It's a callback. But yeah, I mean, it's a huge deal. Um, people go there to find information and if your prospective customers are going to Google and then later that day on, you know, listening to podcasts on Spotify, and then the next morning they're on YouTube asking a question and you can appear in all of those places. That is how you build genuine brands.
Expensive.
Yeah. I mean, maybe, but that is genuinely how you build brand awareness. I mean, those are the brands you actually remember are the ones you see in lots of different places. Not.
Yeah. But it's about understanding who your ideal customers are and where they hang out and what sort of content they consume. Isn't it?
Absolutely.
Which might mean that you've got to be in, you know, you've got to do SEO, you've got to do PPC, you've got to do TikTok, Insta, Facebook, LinkedIn, you've got to do all of this stuff.
But probably.
They're everywhere. And you want to keep popping up, as you say.
But probably not, because I guess that's the point, isn't it? The other, I guess the other direction you can take this in is people go nuts for the idea of omnichannel marketing and just sort of shotgun the whole thing. And they're like, oh, I want an advert on every social media platform. Despite the fact that actual customers are only ever on LinkedIn and Twitter or something like that. So yeah, I think being cautious is definitely really important.
Have you just had enough? Are you just gonna head off?
Well, I'm going to go and project manage my plaster boarding and taping.
Oh right. Okay. Good luck with that. Um right. So moving away from search, what else is, is kind of worth considering. What about, um, account based marketing, for example?
Yeah. I mean.
We don't claim to be experts on account based marketing, but just kind of figuring out who could potentially be interested in your stuff and then figuring out in your offering, and then then figuring out how to get in front of them.
Especially if, like I was saying earlier, this is a sort of very expensive considered purchase where you're trying to sell somebody sort of thirty grand's worth of something over a period of months. Yeah. And going and looking for the people is probably a pretty smart way to do it. Yeah.
Yeah. So I mean, if anyone's anyone's listening to this and they want to come on and talk to us about account based marketing, their experiences with it, etc., that would be good. I think. I think the bottom line is it's not hard to figure out who could benefit from whatever it is you're selling. Mhm. Um, I guess the hard bit with account based marketing is trying to figure out an effective way Of.
Not annoying them.
Not annoying them, and actually getting their attention. Because it's kind of back to the interruption marketing of the last fifty years. Yeah. The, you know, I suppose there's God in calls it the TV industrial complex where you just basically buy the opportunity to force your messaging, if you like, on unsuspecting masses. Um, obviously abm's not really quite as drastic as that, but well, it does create.
A scalpel to the shotgun.
Isn't it? Still, you do need to figure out how to do it in a way that's going to get attention in a good way, not just annoy people, I suppose. I don't think it's something that we want to really dig into too deeply, but another, uh, technique, which is it's kind of a bit a b m ish, I suppose, and we've been experimenting with some of these tools like deal front and lead forensics and Snitcher. For example, and I would strongly recommend, if you haven't tried a fourteen day, no credit card required free trial of Snitcher.
You paid commission for that little. No.
Only say it because the likes of Lead Forensics don't do that. They. They do not give you a completely. Here it is. Free trial. The Snitcher did. And we used it. You know, toying with the idea of of maybe maybe subscribing to it or um, not really sure at the moment, but just explain to people what's what. Snitcher does.
Yeah. So basically, the way I understand it is that these tools sort of build up these huge libraries of which IP addresses relate to which businesses. And what they tell you is basically when somebody comes on your website, if they know what IP address they've used and that it's connected to a company, they'll say, you know, somebody from this company, Barclays or the government or, you know, whatever has been on your website, here's some likely contact details if you want to get in touch with them, and then it'll guess at various people that it might have been because it can't tell you an exact individual. But it's also really useful because like with snitch, for example, they tell you what page that person was on and how long they spent on there and all of that stuff.
How they arrived.
Yeah. So like where account based marketing is basically going like, you know, shove yourself.
A second, just a second. Julie's making an entrance. She's been out doing video and things with clients. So she's back in the office now.
Um, yeah. So we're able, I guess is about sort of forcing yourself in front of the right person. This is more about like finding out what somebody was doing from an organisation on your website so that you can then go and contact them. And it's, I guess, slightly more informed and slightly softer, isn't it?
Yeah, we, we didn't put any serious energy into following up on the information that Snitcher gave us. Um.
Well, I think that's because fundamentally we're very good at the, we're very good at the sort of put useful information out there. Very bad at that be aggressive bit, aren't we? But yeah, that's just our approach really.
I suppose if you're the kind of person who, if you know that somebody from, um A, B, c accountants in Glasgow was on your website and they were looking at, say, a particular product or service, you would be with a degree of tenacity, prepared to go after trying to find who it was at that organisation. You'd maybe connect with people on LinkedIn. You could, you know, snitch will give you some contact details. So you could, you could try three or four emails, um, and see if you can get a bite. And, you know, there are case studies out there of this stuff being extremely successful, but you know, you've got to ask yourself a question. If you got an email, um, from us at red evolution and it's, and it said something like, hey, you know, we, we know somebody from your organisation was on our website, you were looking at our website management offering. Have you got a problem with your website? Are you looking for a company to help you with website management? Um, we know you were on our website because we use this cool tool called snitch a totally transparent and, you know, at the bottom of it, like, you know, if you ignore this email, we won't bother you anymore.
So don't worry.
You're not in a database, you're not going to get spammed. That's not who we're about, who we are. It's not what we're about. So if you're prepared to do stuff like that, then and I know some businesses do that very successfully and it's a huge multi-million pound business. This whole kind of snitching, sniffing, sussing type software, um, it could be really effective. Yeah. And again, it's moving you away from the passive, waiting for people to type a search query into Google and then hoping they click on your advert or click on your organic search result. And then after that, read something that makes them think, yeah, I'm going to get in touch with these people.
Yeah. And I will also add, it is another way of squeezing value out of all of the other channels we've talked about here. I mean, you know, a lot of what we've talked about so far videos, Spotify, PPC, SEO, they're good ways of generating attention. This is a really good way of actually sort of squeezing value out of that attention you've generated, isn't it? It's not necessarily you're still reliant on people getting to your site sight in the first place. But if you're not doing this like. Like you were just saying, I guess, you know, you just sort of passively hoping that people engage. And I think one of the things we know for a fact is you can spend a lot of time and effort getting people's attention, and they will just sort of absorb whatever content you put in front of them, say thanks and sort of wave to you as they ride off into the sunset. They won't get in touch a lot of the time. And, you know, we, we did a couple of weeks with Snitcher and saw loads of huge organisations that we had no idea were on our website because they just don't get in touch. Yeah.
So that's right. Obviously, you know, didn't like what they saw or.
Well, as your face on the website doesn't it?
So that's enough for anyone. Um, but in in addition, you know, what we sell is a, is complex, complicated. And it's very unusual for somebody to go type, type, type or read evolution. Click. Yeah. Ring, ring. Can you do the stuff for me? That's not how it works. People do lots of research. They figure out, you know, whether they like the look of a particular company, and then they reach out at some point, um, to say more or less, can we have a chat? Because we think you might be the right people to help us with a certain thing. Yeah. You know, we know ourselves. We, we were recontacted today. Um, the first conversation was about a month ago from a large organisation down in Southampton, I think, who were looking for some very specific help. And, you know, so much so that I, I'd taken them out of our CRM deals dashboard. I thought, well, they've obviously gone away. So, you know, that's fine. You know, we knew that we were in the mix with other people. And then lo and behold, today they get in touch again because that's just the nature of the beast. You know, we as a small business, uh, operate at the speed of light, you know, make decisions quickly, do things quickly. Larger organisations don't. Do they have that luxury it's worth yeah, it's worth remembering that, you know, we didn't set out to do to kind of go through a list of, of all the different types of marketing that you can do, you know, I've got written down, you know, like radio advertising, joining the local chambers, networking groups, etc., you should be doing all of this stuff as well as the digital stuff. And whether it's social media, PPC, SEO, ABM sniffing software, Snitcher, etc., whether it's any of all that, you know, it's just, just should be a large mix.
It should be a large mix. And critically, it shouldn't be a sort of as well as, as if they're all in separate sort of pots should it? Because all of this stuff, everything that you learn by doing these things sort of has value to the other bits as well. That wasn't very well articulated. I know what I'm trying to say. They're not lots of isolated buckets, are they? You know, you can go to a networking event and learn a little bit more about how to refine your messaging, and that can feed through to making your website better and your PPC campaigns better. And, you know, you really do have to be learning from all of these different channels and sort of plugging all of that data together and doing something very joined up.
When I went to, as I did for about two years, Business Network International, BNI, um, a good few years ago now, but we didn't get any decent business out of it, but made some, you know, made some good friends, met some good people. Um, and. Importantly, week in, week out. I'm gonna sneeze. Oh, bear with me. Oh, here it comes. Oh, for goodness sake. It's gone away.
Now, how to add tension to a story?
Oh, fantastic. Podcasting isn't it? I couldn't help it. You need to sneeze. You need to sneeze.
It's called from the coalface.
Um, what b and I taught me, uh, was how to week in, week out talk in a very succinct way, 30s or forty five seconds about red evolution, what we did, how we helped businesses, what we did for other businesses and said something, you know, say something that kind of helps people understand how to.
Help out.
How to help you find, you know, more business. Um, so yeah, some of these other things, these peripheral things, uh, maybe don't bring in good business directly, but they can certainly help you, uh, figure out how better to talk about your business. Yeah, and that sort of thing. Um, okay. Um, as I expected, given that you chose this subject, it's kind of run out of steam a little bit now, wouldn't you say? Or is there more to say?
I mean, I guess one of the things we could talk about is how to work out because as you were saying yourself earlier, um, it's not necessarily the case that all of these things will work for every business. And I guess there is a piece to be done around working out what tactics are right for your business and how to sort of drill down on that. But I don't really know if that's a subject for this podcast or is just generally that's marketing strategy, I guess, isn't it? That's just.
Yeah, yeah, it might be worth just thinking about, um, outlining what a typical discovery session might look like. We've got a couple of discoveries going on this this week. Um, in fact, I think there's one of them on Thursday, which I think you said you wanted to come along to the one for, uh, the organisation in Aberdeen who needs some HubSpot help. Um, yeah. So we'll, maybe we'll maybe leave that for another podcast. We're just coming up to just under half an hour at the moment. So I think I think we've subjected people to enough of our nonsense for one day, don't you?
Definitely.
Yeah. Okay. Uh, okay. So hopefully that's been of some use. If nothing else, review what you're doing. Don't rely on SEO, especially if you've had some success with SEO. You can be fooled into thinking that it's nirvana, that it's the only thing you need to do. And I suppose in some cases it might be you might generate enough business just doing that. But there's, there's so many other things that you could be doing, um, to, you know, take your business forward and, and find potential customers and talk to people who might be able to help you grow your business. That yeah, are relying on one thing is probably a bad idea. We certainly, you know, learned the hard way. We, we, we completely went all in on SEO and it served us well for a while, but it certainly, um, stopped us growing as quickly as we could have, I think.
Yeah. I think you just have to think about what your audience, you know, actually do online. They're not just going to Google and searching stuff, are they? They're all over the place. And once you start to understand that and you start to think about the fact that what you're trying to do is get and keep their attention, I think it becomes fairly obvious that one tactic can't necessarily deliver that. Mhm.
Okay. Good stuff. Well, you've been listening to Alex and Dave on Digital Marketing From The Coalface. Hopefully that was useful. If you want to come on the show, you know, I get in touch with us. Red evolution dot com. Most pages have got a contact form. Um, other than that, that'll do for now. I'm heading over to to the golf club.
Gonna practice?
No, no, I'm going to talk to them about how to help them grow their sort, grow the social side of the club, get more people using what is a fantastic facility. So it's kind of marketing related. So I thought I'd throw it in there. Very good digital marketing from the golf course. The bunker. The bunker, which is where I find myself most of the time. All right. That'll do for now.